Author Topic: Is there sufficient on-screen information to press the 'Accept'?  (Read 81 times)

Gravitino

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When the opponent is asked to accept the score, he is presented with a screen that tells him the Round, the Table Number, the Board, the Vulnerability, the Contract, the Tricks, and the Score.

What it doesn't say -- which a paper traveller would say -- is the pair numbers of both E-W and N-S.

I grant you that after they press 'Accept', this missing information will be revealed. But I don't believe it is fair to ask E-W to accept the result before they can be sure that the result applies specifically to them and their opponents.

Can this please be fixed?

This week at our table, we had a stroppy opponent who complained about this, and they seem to have a point.

johng

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Re: Is there sufficient on-screen information to press the 'Accept'?
« Reply #1 on: January 24, 2018, 17:26:28 »
I don't see the logic behind this request. The NS and EW pair numbers are displayed at the beginning of the round, together with player names, so that North can check that the correct players have arrived at the table. The NS and EW pair numbers are also displayed in the title bar of the contract entry screen, and on the title bar of the traveller screen after the contract has been accepted (and in the line on the traveller screen which is highlighted in pink). It isn't possible for the ACCEPT screen to be showing the contract/result for the wrong pair unless EW have sat at the wrong table (in which case they have already messed up the session by playing the boards for this round against the wrong NS pair, whether or not they accept the result !). It's up to NS and EW to make sure they have the expected opponents at the start of the round.

Gravitino

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Re: Is there sufficient on-screen information to press the 'Accept'?
« Reply #2 on: January 25, 2018, 17:12:05 »
The issue is not about whether North has checked the identity of the opponents arriving at the table.  It's about whether East/West, when confronted with the screen containing the 'Accept' button, have enough information in front of them on the screen to satisfy themselves that they can fully vouch for this result.

When confronted with the result recorded by North on a paper traveller, E-W will see their pair number and N-S's pair number on the same line as the result.  One club near here even requires E-W to sign the line to show that they accept every data field in that line.  By doing so, E-W is stating something to the effect that: "I am a member of pair two, and this is the result we have just scored on board eight against N-S five."

I don't think it right that the screen presented to E-W when they are required to press the 'Accept' button should contain less information than a paper traveller.  It is not up to E-W to vouch for the competence of North or whether the software works properly -- it is a matter of E-W confirming that on the 'Accept' screen, the only screen which they might have been shown up to that point, all the data presented on the screen is 100% accurate and is unambiguous in that it cannot be about any other board or any other pairing.

johng

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Re: Is there sufficient on-screen information to press the 'Accept'?
« Reply #3 on: January 25, 2018, 17:50:14 »
I don't agree. East/West can certainly vouch for the result based on the information shown because the Accept screen displays the table number, the board number, the contract and result. EW should know the table number they are seated at and the board number that they have just played. They need no other information in order to be able to vouch for the result. If they are inadvertently seated at the wrong table then, of course, they should not have played the board against this particular NS. However, both NS and EW should have checked at the start of the round that they are in the correct place - it's too late after the board has been played, they have already created a major problem for the director.

Paper travellers are a different matter because NS can fill in the pair number information on the traveller incorrectly, and therefore it's important that EW check it. When entering results via BridgePal the NS and EW pair numbers are filled in by the system, not by NS, thus eliminating the possibility of human error and the need for EW to check. Nevertheless, if they are still concerned they can look at the traveller screen which appears immediately after they have tapped the ACCEPT button. The traveller screen does show the NS and EW pair numbers for all tables that have played that board. It also features an ERROR button, so it's possible to go back and make a correction to the contract or result if an error is detected at that stage.

Reg Hull

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Re: Is there sufficient on-screen information to press the 'Accept'?
« Reply #4 on: January 28, 2018, 18:13:22 »
We have never had a problem.
When EW arrive at the table NS check they have the correct pair. in cases where North has moved on from the screen displaying pair numbers and names, the correct pairing can be verified by checking the display at the top.
If one EW pair is on the wrong place than so is another so the chances are close to zero. Finally if an error in seating has occurred this can be corrected during the evening.
Personally I think it would be too much information.
Why do you need to confirm something that has already been agreed?
The way I look at this is that this is not trying to replicate a paper traveller, it is providing an efficient method of recording and scoring.
In a year of use, averaging over 7 tables, this has never happened. Also I am in touch with other clubs who use BridgePal and they have never had this issue.
Once the accept button is presses and you go into the traveller screen, then pair numbers are displayed. This fulfils your requirements, because at this stage the pair numbers are displayed. So why have it on the previous page?
I for one would vote against this development.

 
« Last Edit: January 28, 2018, 19:12:43 by Reg Hull »